Ketosis v. Plant-Based – Diet Wars with Cardiologist Joel Kahn, MD

Ketosis v. Plant-Based – Diet Wars with Cardiologist Joel Kahn, MD

The nutrition debate is as emotional as it is divisive. To help divine truth from fiction, I sat down with cardiologist Joel Kahn, MD.

✌🏼🌱 – Rich

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Hi I’m Rich Roll. Nice to meet you. I’m a vegan ultra-endurance athlete and podcaster. I write books and travel the world giving talks. But mainly I’m a dad of four. My wife Julie is much better at stuff than me. She is a yogi, musician, mom, and vegan chef & cookbook author. She makes amazing nut cheese. If you want to know more, the NY Times wrote a couple things about us:


  1. Commenting as an ex vegan for six years, I did feel great on the diet initially but it lead to the worst gut inflammation I’ve ever had in my life, it affected my mental health greatly (look at all vegans they are not mentally at peace or happy ) I got operated on my anal fissures and piles because the intestinal inflammation had gone out of control. I never ate vegan junk, processed fake meats, everything was home cooked and super “healthy” yet it got me terribly sick !
    All it took was 15 days of eating eggs and fish to feel “normal” I’ve been eating an animal based diet for one year now and oh boy my health has transformed 360• !!
    They can make a 100 game changers documentaries but I know what I went through, the pain, the agony, the sad gloomy clouds of not being mentally happy. Veganism is dangerous to say the least. Try it yourself and plz be honest about it.
    Vegans mean well, they want to save the planet and animals and think their “diet” is good for their bodies. Nothing could be further from the truth. It’s cult like brainwashing that’s supported by massive pharmaceutical and big corporations.

  2. Having lived with multiple auto-immune conditions for years, I’m always trying to learn and adapt my diet and lifestyle to live with the least amount of inflammation and I tried keto for one month and it set my healing journey back years! This diet is a ticking time bomb.

  3. Great interview. I see there are plenty of derogatory comments from those that disagree, but how about we just accept that there is some merit in plant based eating, even if you don’t fully agree with it? I’m one of the many who will see both sides of the arguments at either end of the scale, but the truth surely has to be what both keto and plant based have in common…..cut out processed foods and you will do a lot better. Also that Intermittent fasting is good whether on keto or plant based. Me, I’ll continue being plant based with very occasionally eating a bit of fish or very small amount of dairy, it’s working for me and as long as it does I’ll continue with it. Love these podcasts, so much to discover and think about – and act upon.

  4. For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. (Romans 10:13)
    Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon. (Isaiah 55:7)
    When Jesus heard it, he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance. (Mark 2:17)

  5. There are a lot of good arguments for the plant based diet. But manure is fertilizer. This has been settled science for thousands of years.

  6. Very good discussion. The easy and clear answer is a whole food diet. Avoid all processed foods. Period. If we do that, eating lots of veg, fruit, legumes, etc we will thrive.

  7. This interview was very informative. I’m a long time keto eater who very recently read Longo’s book and made drastic changes towards plant based (with occasional fish and eggs). Thanks.

  8. I was vegan for 5,5 years. Eating only Whole Foods, mostly raw, but I looked like trash, very slim but fatty at the same time around my belly, no shape of muscle and lazy as hell. I don’t ate sugar at all, or sugary stuff, only the sugar in plants and fruits, what is naturally contained.
    When I started reducing carbs in my diet, it just got better. I can focus better and my body is getting in to good shape.
    As much I like the idea of a vegan lifestyle, it didn’t work for me. After following a certain diet for this long that’s disappointing…

  9. Dave asprey doesn’t say butter in your coffee is good for you. He says you can have that and it will not break your fast

  10. I love hearing different perspectives and took something from this guest, but I’m turned off with how disrespectful he is to doctors that feel differently than himself. He’s extremely dismissive of anything he doesn’t agree with. It’s not like he has unimpeachable credentials…he teaches at Wayne State.

  11. What the health was the worst thing I’ve ever watched. Calling the who and quizzing the receptionist on the science 🤣🤣🤣🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️
    And if they didn’t know the answer they acted like it was a conspiracy

  12. both sides keep fighting ,the answer is very obvious. both are correct to a degree. plants have natural defenses, they Detox !!!
    they clean .they have many minerals .
    Meat is more complete food. the many animals deal with the plant defenses better than we do. they convert them into food that we can use,better then our digestive systems do, animal protein is more complete protein then vegetable protein, the dog eats meat, it eats grass on occasion and sometimes vegetables too. why ? for medicine. it has a purpose. we need to acquire the knowledge to see that balance. we have lost the knowledge. we should not base our diet on if we love animals, or what we think will save the world, we should base our diet on what is best for our health.  
    it looks like meat from animals and other animal foods are very beneficial, but plants are needed too. of course both sides will hate me for saying this !

  13. What are you doing to bring these options and education into “food deserts” like poor towns in Appalachia or inner-city ghettos? What groups are doing boots on ground work in poor areas not just $$$ summits and Google meets? I’d like to get your recommendations to support.

  14. I can’t stand how these doctors and scientists make blanket statements like they have a full understanding of everything when it’s clear they do not. I’ve tried keto and vegan and I think both have their merits. I’ve heard many cases of people who have stopped cancer in it’s tracks with a strict keto or carnivore diet. Also him telling me not to watch a documentary with other information is going to make me watch it.

  15. I believe the biggest problem with keto, low carb, and carnivore is the amount of transfat they consume everyday. The average person doing these diets eats two pounds of transfat per year.

  16. Hey RIch, stop being a wuss and interview some people on the LCHF/Keto/Carnivore side as well as Jason Fung already. Because you are just promoting one side and that is not very nice of you.

  17. I want to inform the public on how me and my son got cured of our Genital Herpes 1&2 and HPV by DR ALAHO OLU on YouTube.

  18. This guy is arrogant AF. Guy is passive aggressive with rampent logical fallacies and it totally turns me off.
    I am not keto or vegan or paleo , its all just money making buzz words now. I eat healthy from all food groups in small portions and exercise. These extremist food nazies are THE problem.
    This guy IS the problem.

  19. A plant based diet that gave me type 2 diabetes in the first place. I now will continue to eat meat, eggs, cheese, fish, and drink milk no matter what the vegan hate trolls say, or the so called peer reviewed studies they link to, or what any vegan propaganda video says. Eating meat and choosing your own diet is a HUMAN RIGHT!

  20. Thank you for this! I’m furiously taking notes when Dr. Kahn talks about the genetic-based lipoprotein and that it’s not routinely included in a blood panel. So much valuable information!

  21. Why do you keep interviewing rediculous doctors over and over? This guy once said canola oil is good to prevent heart disease. And Dr. Kim A Williams said saturated fat and high cholesterol cause heart disease. He also says Atorvastatin is good to lower your cholesterol. While the world leading cardiologists say high cholesterol and saturated fat cannot cause heart disease.

  22. Disregarding vegan doctors’ takes on the health benefits of veganism is just 100 % a bait. Saying you can’t trust them because of their bias implies that you would take the same points seriously were they given by a non-vegan doctor but in reality, were you to present them one, the statement changes to "if veganism is that great to one’s health, why are *you* still eating animal products?"

  23. I’ve always been known for a very sweet tooth, and I find my best personal remedy for my cravings of high-calorie, refined-sugar foods when I’m hungry, is lots of fresh fruit that contains plentiful natural sugars – absolutely love bananas and keen on apples, pears too – as well as carrots, broccoli, parsnips etc

  24. How long has a vegan diet been a natural diet? You don’t even seem to know what the ketogenic diet is about and tell me what has a vegan diet ever cured?NOTHING! You would have to stay really healthy on a vegan diet and keep you teeth clean, being on a sugar loaded diet they would fall out first.

  25. I will solve the worlds obesity epidemic. Stop eating all the junk foods. Fast food and all highly processed foods are horrible for you. STOP all that and the world will change. We spend way too much time on what diet to choose. We sound like a bunch of teenagers. All these people that support there diet all they want is the recognition that there diet is the diet. Stop battling it’s ridiculous. Get together and advocate to STOP the the consumption all the highly processed junk foods.

  26. So The Doctor Aseem Malhotra diet is rubbish is it? You’ve never seen it, won’t watch it, and are too scared to see what it’s all about? Now that’s what I call narrow-minded. He’s a famous cardiologist and knows more than you do about the heart and liver.

  27. I was told by my doctor not to stick with the ketogenic diet because it’s unhealthy. He said I should eat a diverse diet so I tried the Agoge diet and I am starting noticing less stubborn belly fat really fast.

  28. My dad had that, silent heart disease. Cardiac arrest while running. Didn’t survive. He was seen a month before for an annual check up and was told he’s healthy.

  29. Skip this one, dislike and unsubscribe like did. they tell you nothing other then don’t eat butter and pepperoni. Most the time they are name dropping or reminiscing with each other which has nothing in it for us, they think its interesting for us I guess, as if they were movie or sports stars. A real turkey, keep looking there are better actually informative videos on You Tube.

  30. "Nina Teicholz

    "Also there is no rigorous evidence to show that dairy fat (or any animal fat) makes you fat. In fact, children drinking whole milk grow up to be leaner (association only data, not causation–but again, contradict the existing hypothesis)."

  31. Can’t we all just get along:)
    The foodie wars has got to stop. Eating healthy, less processed food, exercise more, cut out soda, waaaay less processed sugar, less fried food And u r doing better than Many Americans.

  32. Robert lustig explains all the science.
    The problem with the status quo food advice is its stuck in the dark ages and wrong, proliferated by the agricultural agency, not the food agency

  33. This guy once said "when I bust a blocked artery open I don’t find sugar, I find fat"
    Thats the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard said.
    Eating sugar causes fat gain.

  34. Good discussion. Nobody talks about how a ketogenic diet is real difficult long term, and needlessly expensive. Especially if it’s well-planned and excludes processed meat and includes "keto-friendly" plant foods (like almonds, avocado, coconut, cauliflower, kale, etc.). Grass-fead meat in particular is exceedingly expensive in the US to have as a substantial part of your diet.

  35. He talks about carnivore about how people are just doing whatever they want and they don’t care about their lab work. I did care, it cured my severe depression after 7 years, i made hypothesis about why that happened and have a few ideas, this is now 3 years old podcast so the evidence has come out to a degree aswell as to why it had that effect. But i did do my labs after 2 weeks, then 1 month then 3 months and soon 6 months. so far all my labs have improved. I was tricked once by my government that a low animal fat high plant food diet was good for me, so i have become very humble after that, and i am trying to be extremely careful and unbiased about what my diet might do that helps me and not help me.

    But his statement is just pure nonsense.

  36. The theory is consuming too much sugar will spike insulin enough to the point where the cells become resistant to the excess amount of glucose in the blood. Sure, glucose in the blood is important, the issue is about it being in excessive. What a dishonest way to frame that.

  37. How about we all stick to an unprocessed whole food diet weather it be vegan, keto, paleo, whatever. Stick to a healthy diet that you can stick with. That would be a huge step in the right direction for society. Personally I am mostly plant based.

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